Dealer mark ups suck

[Magnified]

What a goat rodeo

Dodge could have at least had the decency to offer us a coupon for a discount on KY !
"Grab your KY and apply liberally before visiting your dealer to try & order any of these last call cars" should be added to their warning list ...................

Kentucky is getting a bad rap!

 

[Bobo]

Was playing around in it all morning, and now, busted, yep LOL

You are the one that broke it!! It's your fault

 

[Boris]

After doing some digging (ok a LOT of digging) way before today, I might add...
Here is my semi-quantitative analysis of how this is gonna play out...

The very few dealers (top 200-300 out of 2800 Nationwide or 7-10%) that actually get ONE allocation for the 909 Number 7*car, the OWNER of the dealership will be buying the car in the majority of cases. The remaining sales, from the numbers I kept hearing, will likely be for +75K to 2x MSRP for that car. Yes, there may be a few that go for less, but it's all relative...pricing for those precious few cars might be in the +15-30K range and people will snap those up faster than you can take a breath of air. As part of this escapade, I spoke with over 10 dealerships that sold MSRP Demons who have NEVER marked up a car. This one? Yep! Marking it up. Believe it. My guess is that they think they are going to lose most of their customers after this no matter what so F**k it. Hard to argue against that logic...

*I spoke with a Stellantis regional rep as part of my market research/due diligence. He told me yesterday that the 7 car is on hold INDEFINITELY since they are "having issues with the engine". He said it is indeed an E85 car (part of the problem he added) and yes it has 909 hp. Not 1000, not 929. He also said that with all the other production problems they are having right now, there is a non-zero chance that 7 will never see the light of day and that they call it quits with the 6 that are already announced. Take that for what it's worth...oh, and don't shoot the messenger, lol.

When it got pulled from SEMA to go along with the DC kits still not out, you knew something was up and it wasn't good.

Meanwhile, I'm totally boned on the Super Stock. Found 2 last spring that I could have had for 1% under invoice.
Now MSRP dealers are sold and everyone else is 10k+

I found 2 dealers last night willing to do MSRP on a ZL1. A Jailbreak WB Hellcat 717hp is over 90k how I would want it for a 22. Assuming a couple grand more for a 23. ZL1 is under 70k.

20k is a nice downpayment on a new TRX.

 

[Boris]

Timmy did say it was destined for the history books!
Just not how.

 

[1971demon]

I think Stelantis should have put a little more thought into this last #7 offering...(that's even if there is one)..now we all have contempt for ADM's of any kind...and the dealers aren't fond of the speculators (flippers) buying at MSRP..and then cashing in big time...I get the argument on both sides of the issue...they are both valid....Here's the fix...take whatever the production run is 500/1000/ or whatever...Stelantis can mandate to the dealer network that the cars Must be sold @ MSRP or the dealer gets no allocation..conversely in the consumer sales agreement..there is a "no sale" stipulation for one year...now is it perfect...hell no..but it would be better than the shit show we will see if and when these things are produced....and I don't buy any notion that it couldn't be done...just my .02

 

[Illegal_Demon]

I think Stelantis should have put a little more thought into this last #7 offering...(that's even if there is one)..now we all have contempt for ADM's of any kind...and the dealers aren't fond of the speculators (flippers) buying at MSRP..and then cashing in big time...I get the argument on both sides of the issue...they are both valid....Here's the fix...take whatever the production run is 500/1000/ or whatever...Stelantis can mandate to the dealer network that the cars Must be sold @ MSRP or the dealer gets no allocation..conversely in the consumer sales agreement..there is a "no sale" stipulation for one year...now is it perfect...hell no..but it would be better than the shit show we will see if and when these things are produced....and I don't buy any notion that it couldn't be done...just my .02

See the ford gt. ford crowned millionaires they liked (media influencers, celebrities, already mega rich ppl). And shockingly these Chosen Ones happily bought at msrp (500k) and 2 yrs and 1 day later dumped them on BAT for a cool mil a pop. Can you blame them? The easy answer is stellantis charges market price. If it’s flippable for 200, have that as msrp. Do I want that? No. But THATS how you end this game. the OEM not customers or dealers make the big profit. Honestly that's what i would do if i ran the place.

 

[Ricky Racer]

Sorry gang but that new Dark Horse is looking pretty good at $60K fully optioned. Assuming Ford doesn’t play the same games anyway.

Ford and Chevy and actually all car manufactures play the same games with ADM on there top models. Why would Dodge be any different.

 

[Magnified]

Dark horse 60k? Thought it was 100k

 

[Speedy!]

I'd simply open up direct to manufacturer ordering and make it a bidding system on each car. Done.

 

[1971demon]

See the ford gt. ford crowned millionaires they liked (media influencers, celebrities, already mega rich ppl). And shockingly these Chosen Ones happily bought at msrp (500k) and 2 yrs and 1 day later dumped them on BAT for a cool mil a pop. Can you blame them? The easy answer is stellantis charges market price. If it’s flippable for 200, have that as msrp. Do I want that? No. But THATS how you end this game. the OEM not customers or dealers make the big profit. Honestly that's what i would do if i ran the place.

Then that would put the offering out of reach of the majority of true aficionados..(like most of on here)...that would actually drive them..so why even do it...

 

[Illegal_Demon]

Then that would put the offering out of reach of the majority of true aficionados..(like most of on here)...that would actually drive them..so why even do it...

As I said...do I want that? Of course not. But the bottom line is if you place a price that's OBVIOUSLY well below what supply-demand is dictating (I think we can ALL agree that's the case here)....then SOMEONE is gonna make a big chunk of "extra" money...right now its the buyer who flips, or the dealer who ADMs. just funny how the OEMs have never said, "hey what about US making more bank!" After all. this is still capitalistic America, right? I saw you X' my post...lol...Not saying I want this, but kinda surprised big biz has not gone in that obvious direction.

 

[Confuzed1]

What a goat rodeo

Dodge could have at least had the decency to offer us a coupon for a discount on KY !
"Grab your KY and apply liberally before visiting your dealer to try & order any of these last call cars" should be added to their warning list ...................

You just gotta be flexible when visiting your local Dodge dealer. -So long as you can bend forward at the waist....you're flexible enough...

 

[Boris]

See the ford gt. ford crowned millionaires they liked (media influencers, celebrities, already mega rich ppl). And shockingly these Chosen Ones happily bought at msrp (500k) and 2 yrs and 1 day later dumped them on BAT for a cool mil a pop. Can you blame them? The easy answer is stellantis charges market price. If it’s flippable for 200, have that as msrp. Do I want that? No. But THATS how you end this game. the OEM not customers or dealers make the big profit. Honestly that's what i would do if i ran the place.

Well they tried that with the Gen V Viper and it was a flop. Until the ACR came out.
Now those are going for big $$$ and regular Vipers back at sticker. But when the Hellcat came out, the Viper was unloved and unwanted.

So price a 60k Hellcat at 180k and sell what 30 of them?

 

[1971demon]

As I said...do I want that? Of course not. But the bottom line is if you place a price that's OBVIOUSLY well below what supply-demand is dictating (I think we can ALL agree that's the case here)....then SOMEONE is gonna make a big chunk of "extra" money...right now its the buyer who flips, or the dealer who ADMs. just funny how the OEMs have never said, "hey what about US making more bank!" After all. this is still capitalistic America, right? I saw you X' my post...lol...Not saying I want this, but kinda surprised big biz has not gone in that obvious direction.

I simply X it because I disagree with the logic..since it's inception in 2015..HC/RE/Demons have been coveted by middle class owners that drive them..race them...and just overall enjoy them..as far as the Demon..some bought...put them away and speculated on them taking a moon shot...those were not the majority..and I don't believe that was the motor company's intention to have them purchased by those who just intended to flip them...I also don't believe their intention with #7..is to relegate it to the very affluent that are willing..(and able) to lay out 200 plus..I believe the spirit and the essence of this latest (and supposedly very limited) offering is to give a select few die hard Challenger fans a chance regardless of how slim to own something truly unique and very special at a reasonably affordable price...to enjoy...the very rich already have the Ferraris...the Lambos..the Ford GT..and for the mega rich the Bugatti..that's not the segment that made these Challengers such a success since 2015...and I don't think capitalism has a place in the discussion...

 

[Illegal_Demon]

Well they tried that with the Gen V Viper and it was a flop. Until the ACR came out.
Now those are going for big $$$ and regular Vipers back at sticker. But when the Hellcat came out, the Viper was unloved and unwanted.

So price a 60k Hellcat at 180k and sell what 30 of them?

You are confusing the 2017 market with 2022. Apples, watermelons.

plus as I said who would buy a 125k car 7? Nearly EVERYONE on this board . When you can confidently say that, it means unequivocally that the car is Underpriced. In fact Every single time a dealer can ask and get a big ADM it means the car is underpriced. Very simple supply-demand 101. So -somebody- gets to keep that market $$ dislocation. That’s all I’m saying. I don’t think it’s all that controversial.

 

[MiHiHemi]

Dark horse 60k? Thought it was 100k

For you Mag.

 

[Boris]

You are confusing the 2017 market with 2022. Apples, watermelons.

plus as I said who would buy a 125k car 7? Nearly EVERYONE on this board . When you can confidently say that, it means unequivocally that the car is Underpriced. In fact Every single time a dealer can ask and get a big ADM it means the car is underpriced. Very simple supply-demand 101. So -somebody- gets to keep that market $$ dislocation. That’s all I’m saying. I don’t think it’s all that controversial.

13-15 market
Pre Hellcat market

And many Jailbreak allocations sat unused last year.
Can still get new 21 Hellcat Durangos

At sticker, these cars are overpriced. Dodge is good at marketing and creating hype. Car hasn't changed since 2019. So if a 23 is worth 125k, why is a 19 or 20 Redeye sitting around half that?

I'm not interested in future value, i want to drive and race the car and have fun with it. My kids can sell it when i'm dead.

 

[hell on wheels]

“Buy High Sell Low”

Make two people Happy.

 

[DGatzby]

I’ll rant.

Not all dealers are created the same is the problem here.

I visited a large dealer here in the Twin Cities in August. These guys were talking like they were preparing me to bend over to order ANYTHING from a new fictional Hornet we cannot even see or feel, up to and including any Challenger or Durango of any type. The salesman took me right to the elevated “desk” of Sales Managers etc. where I was to be impressed with the physical position of these beggars, looking important and talking bullshit? Whatever I told them I was considering, they had a reason/story to support either it was going to cost MSRP-Plus and/or was going to take a year to arrive. Asked about buying something on the lot, and work with them coming back the other way to sell/trade on a future new order? WORSE! I should expect to pay stupid inflated prices today because of big problems currently, but the used vehicle would likely be worth crap in a few months, forget that thought or plan also sir.

The evaluation and decisions are easy Dodge! Ordering my third vehicle in seven years from yet another State. Third different state/dealer for each vehicle. A Hellcat, a REWB, and now a Durango SRT at another “smaller” dealer who a friend has a connection with and appreciates good old fashioned reasonable profits. They also respect their customer.

They can take these few thousand vehicles that are not going to get driven and just traded/sold to ultra wealthy collectors and shove them. Keep it up Dodge, because if and when I can get lucky enough that my number is called for a Z06 at MSRP as is promised and I need some extra cash to close that deal, this Redeye will be sold. At $175,000 those still are a good value compared to what they will stand against on the tracks.

I’ll have pictures, videos and memories. I am only loyal to a point. Me and too many of my friends are being treated like shit by our “brand”. I am quickly losing my feelings of pride in a brand that is really screwing their best customers now.

Not that GM is any better, but at least it seems they have a few honest and responsible dealers in their network. We shall see about that soon also. GM better be careful, their WOKE EV advertising sucks, their cancellation of ads on Twitter this morning makes me question WTF. Are they entirely WOKE and dismissing the platform because they are not canceling out “conservative” opinions and posts now? They piss off old guys like me and others enough and those Vettes may not be looking as good either when we decide our money won’t be going their way either!

 

[Boris]

I’ll rant.

Not all dealers are created the same is the problem here.

I visited a large dealer here in the Twin Cities in August. These guys were talking like they were preparing me to bend over to order ANYTHING from a new fictional Hornet we cannot even see or feel, up to and including any Challenger or Durango of any type. The salesman took me right to the elevated “desk” of Sales Managers etc. where I was to be impressed with the physical position of these beggars, looking important and talking bullshit? Whatever I told them I was considering, they had a reason/story to support either it was going to cost MSRP-Plus and/or was going to take a year to arrive. Asked about buying something on the lot, and work with them coming back the other way to sell/trade on a future new order? WORSE! I should expect to pay stupid inflated prices today because of big problems currently, but the used vehicle would likely be worth crap in a few months, forget that thought or plan also sir.

The evaluation and decisions are easy Dodge! Ordering my third vehicle in seven years from yet another State. Third different state/dealer for each vehicle. A Hellcat, a REWB, and now a Durango SRT at another “smaller” dealer who a friend has a connection with and appreciates good old fashioned reasonable profits. They also respect their customer.

They can take these few thousand vehicles that are not going to get driven and just traded/sold to ultra wealthy collectors and shove them. Keep it up Dodge, because if and when I can get lucky enough that my number is called for a Z06 at MSRP as is promised and I need some extra cash to close that deal, this Redeye will be sold. At $175,000 those still are a good value compared to what they will stand against on the tracks.

I’ll have pictures, videos and memories. I am only loyal to a point. Me and too many of my friends are being treated like shit by our “brand”. I am quickly losing my feelings of pride in a brand that is really screwing their best customers now.

Not that GM is any better, but at least it seems they have a few honest and responsible dealers in their network. We shall see about that soon also. GM better be careful, their WOKE EV advertising sucks, their cancellation of ads on Twitter this morning makes me question WTF. Are they entirely WOKE and dismissing the platform because they are not canceling out “conservative” opinions and posts now? They piss off old guys like me and others enough and those Vettes may not be looking as good either when we decide our money won’t be going their way either!

GM dealers suck too but not as bad.
My local ones are greedy bastards where my local Dodge dealer is a straight shooter. Except my local dealer who sold me their Demon for MSPR, didn't get 1 fkn Hellcat for 2023. They had 3 of them for sale in the last year so I don't get the math from Dodge.

But whatever, have fun selling those Hornets next year.